On tonight’s show we talk with some Cache Valley residents who attended some of the demonstrations today in Salt Lake surrounding the President’s visit to Utah. Jen Francina and Fred Wagner attended Rocky Anderson’s rally this morning at the City County Building. Heidi Hodgson attended the pro-Bush rally this evening and was on the tarmac as the President landed in Salt Lake.

Also a hearty discussion on the reasons and justifications for the War and a critique of the arguments made by both pro and anti-war activists.

And…. we had so much material we did another bonus podcast. Click here to listen. In it we go into great detail regarding the weaknesses of arguments on boths sides of the war issue and have a conversation with Salt Lake County Councilman Joe Hatch on pluralism in the war in Iraq.

Thanks to KUTV for granting permission for the audio clips of Mayor Rocky Andersons speech. To view the entire speech visit KUTV’s website.

From today’s Salt Lake Tribune:

Protest politics also flared at the county complex Tuesday when Democratic County Councilman Joe Hatch attempted to defend Anderson’s rally – and Corroon – before he was shouted down by a man from Sandy and ruled out of order in an open meeting.

In an impassioned speech, Hatch chastised Utah GOP leaders for attempting to squelch dissent, saying he thought after Vietnam such tactics were “long gone in this country.”

“You have a right to come out and disagree with this war and this president and not be called a traitor,” he said.

Jacob Burns, a Sandy resident, repeatedly interrupted Hatch. “I did not come to listen to this,” he barked. “Do you have any issues you want to be addressing rather than this diatribe?”

The crowd applauded when Hatch was ruled out of order, but fellow Democrats defended him.

I had hoped this was a lesson that Utah had learned and moved on from during the 2004 Michael Moore controversy at UVSC. Supressing, punishing or attempting to limit speech with disagree with is unethical and in every way unAmerican. The very or strength or weakness of our democracy comes in large part from our ability, or tragic inability to civilly engage those with whom we disagree. That is what has set America apart from those countries where violence and other unethical means of suppression are the response to unpopular thought.

Regardless of our positions on the war or President Bush, we ought to be cultivating environments where healthy, respectful and robust dialouge is taking place. No one should ever be silenced and “ruled out of order” because of an unpopular opinion. This incident is a black eye the State of Utah.

John Dehlin, host of Mormon Stories, fills in for Ryan Yonk on this For the People.
Fugitive Warren Steed Jeffs was arrested early this morning just outside of Las Vegas. Joining us on KVNU’s For the People will be Ben Bistline, former member of the religious group now known at the FLDS, Trooper Kevin Honea of the Nevada Highway Patrol has details on the arrest, and Paul Murphey of the Utah Attorney General’s Office.

Also, tonight we have a bonus podcast with material and interviews John Dehlin and Tom Grover couldn’t fit into the live show! Included is an interview with Vicky Prunty of Tapestry Against Polygamy and Andrea Esquer of the Arizona Attorney General’s Office. To listen to the bonus podcast, click here!

Related Documents & Sites

• The Primer, an introduction to polygamous communities prepared by the Utah & Arizona Attorney’s Generals Offices
• FLDS news, photos, audio and other material at the Eldorado Success.
• Wikipedia articles: FLDS Church, Warren Jeffs, Ervil Lebaron, Apostolic United Brethren,
• From the Salt Lake Tribune’s Polygamy in Utah special section: Leadership/Sect Pedigree, photos of 1953 Shortcreek Raid, and more!
• Tapestry Against Polygamy
• Principle Voices, a pro-polygamy website/advocacy group.

Special thanks to John Dehlin for guest hosting tonight!

Ryan and I have talked about this several times on For the People recently- the dramatic drop in the level of discourse both nationwide and on talk radio.   In today’s Tribune, Bryan Hyde delivers an excellent editorial on this tragic phenomenon:

The days in which opinions could be exchanged and the truth could stand on its own merits are fading. Perhaps it’s still possible in some circles, but talk radio is increasingly becoming a medium where the polarization is nearly absolute. When we’ve reached the point where we can no longer talk to one another, we’re setting the stage for real conflict such as we’ve seen in the Balkans and Middle East.

Some will certainly counter that talk radio is only giving the audience what it wants. I understand perfectly how the game is played and I’ve successfully thrown red meat to the crowd to generate ratings and can testify that it does work. But if it’s just about the ratings and doing whatever it takes to create them, then let’s at least be honest and admit that talk radio now has more in common with Jerry Springer or pro wrestling. 

It is our goal on For the People not to convert you to our political paradigms, although we freely share our opinions, but to provide a forum where all viewpoints can safely fully articulate their positions and where understanding, even in the face of disagreement, can increase.   That’s what we mean when we say, “we’re anti-shout-down talk radio”   These are the roots of talk radio and what makes the forum so magical and so vitally important.   We hope you’ll join us in our journey.

State Senator Chris Buttars discusses judicial reform. A portion of the interview:

Tom Grover: What do you say to the argument that some people will make that the courts are really the way for those that are in the minority and would otherwise be oppressed by the will of the majority to ensure that their rights are protected?

Senator Buttars: I don’t understand that at all, why if somebody goes to a court…. give me an example, I don’t know of an example of where the minority is being jeopordized by legislative action.

Tom Grover: Like Brown vs. Board of Education.

Senator Buttars: Well I think Brown v. Board of Education is wrong to beging with

Ryan Yonk: What was wrong about it?

Senator Buttars: That’s a whole nuther subject.

Tom Grover: I’d love to hear this

Senator Buttars: One day you’ll call me again and we’ll take a half hour on that one.

In the second half hour Mayor Rocky Anderson discusses protesting President Bush during his visit to Salt Lake later this month.

Third parties in American politics are an interesting phenomenon. We have seen many throughout our history, most of them short lived and in response to a particular issue or dischord with one or both of the two major parties. Without going into a tremendous amount of detail, our system of government will by nature only have two parties in the long run as opposed to a truly multi-party Parliamentary system.

The Constitution Party of Utah seems to be gaining a meaningful following in Utah and Cache County as of late. Given how overwhelmingly Republican Utah and Cache County are it is almost certain that the Constitution Party will have absolutely no effect upon the outcome of the November elections by splitting the conservative vote.

The Utah Constitution Party’s platform is a mix of religion (orthodox Mormonism to be exact) and hard line conservatism. The sites of candidates and the party that I have read explicitly, liberally and unabashedly quote from the political rhetoric of Ezra Taft Benson as well as a few other LDS leaders and the Standard Works (Bible, Book of Mormon, D&C). When visiting Latter-day Conservative (not officially connected to the party from what I can see, but run by supporters) you will selective quotes from all LDS Presidents implying a conservative idealogy among all of them. I had to chuckle just a little bit at the notion of my early LDS leaders as conservative thinkers when in reality they were flaming socialists (especially Brigham Young- my all time favorite socialist!).

Like most third parties, the Constitution Party of Utah seems to have been gaining ground based upon neo-conservatives disillusionment with the all to liberal and comprimising Utah Republican Party.

From Mark Hudson’s (1st congressional district candidate) website:

Our nation is in trouble. The Republican Party has failed, so I joined the Constitution Party. We should no longer vote for the “lesser of two evils”. Abraham Lincoln was elected to the presidency on a 3rd party ticket with less than 40% of the vote. Don’t say that it can’t be done! We must all stand for something. All Americans must fight to preserve our nation’s sovereignty and save our Constitution or someday we will no longer be Americans – let alone Republicans or Democrats.

Take a look around the websites these guys have put together. They are designed to appeal to a very narrow demographic- orthodox literalist Mormons who see conservatism as not only a political philosophy, but an appendage of their pure theology.

It is this potent mix of religion and government that has consistently throughout history yielded corrosive effects upon faith and politics. God had a place in our society. That place, however, is to be determined by the individual at the individual level. The institutions of government cannot and should not be a conduit of faith no matter how well intentioned.

Constitution Party of Utah
Scott Bradley, Senate Candidate
Mark Hudson, 1st District
David Perry, 2nd District
Jim Noorlander, 3rd District

Part 2 of our interview with Orrin Hatch, Bobby Darvish and Malik Muhammed of the Muslim Forum of Utah discuss Islam, terrorism, religion and the state of the Muslim community in Utah and the United States.  610kvnu.com exclusive extended interview here.

Many of you might be aware of an anti-Mormon protestor who was arrested for disorderly conduct in Clarkston Saturday night at the Martin Harris Pagaent. Some might wonder why we don’t discuss this event on For the People, or more specifically why we don’t name the man or his organization. For our purposes, we’ll call him Billy Bob and his organization that we’ll call the Billy Bob’s Anti-Mormon Heman Woman Hater Club. For The People is a pluralistic show where are respectful viewpoints are welcome. A few months ago we decided not to interview the Church group that protests soldiers funeral because we recognize that their action is driven by the media attention it is given. Anti-Mormons also faithfully protest LDS General Conference in April and October. They do and say outrageous things and usually lead the 10 PM news in the Salt Lake market. Yet, the rest of the year these protesters are noticeably absent despite Temple Square being Utah’s #1 tourist destination. If these people were really interested in sharing their views on Mormonism with as many people as possible, they would protest year round at Temple Square. But they don’t- they only show up when the camera’s arrive.
The reason for Billy Bob’s behavior is simple- the purpose of his conduct was to garner media attention for himself and his anti-Mormon organization. According to the Herald Journal, one of the first things he did after being arrested was notify the media.

There is nothing truly unique or outstanding about what Billy Bob did Saturday night nor the behavior of his organization. Billy Bob peddles religious intolerance, hate, bigotry and misunderstanding. He justifies his crass and inappropriate behavior by the sanctity of his cause. He also insists that he is not an anti-Mormon, “We say we love Mormons”. Billy Bob’s professed love of Mormons rings shallow, patronizing and insincere. A requisite component of love is respect, something that Billy Bob’s actions Saturday night demonstrates he lacks for Mormons, let alone love. Now, to be sure there are those who disagree with Mormonism. Not all of them are like Billy Bob. A lot of them know how to disagree without being disagreeable. Even with their differences with Mormonism, they find a way to maintain respect and friendship.

Billy Bob is motivated by hate and bigotry thinly veiled in his brand of Christianity. He is motivated, at least in part, by a need to be recognized and highlighted in the media. We disapprove of the irresonsible and bigoted way in which Billy Bob has entered the public discourse, and as punishment will not give him the media attention he so desperately wants. We will not utter his real name nor the name of his hate group.

So, sorry Billy Bob, as far as For the People is concerned, you mission has failed.

On tonight’s show we interview Cache County Republican Party Chairman David Butterfield on the party’s activity’s this weekend at the Cache County Fair.

We also speak with John Dehlin of Mormon Stories who is presenting tonight at the annual Salt Lake Sunstone Symposium in Salt Lake City.

Utah State University Provost Raymond Coward discusses USU’s listing as a Top 25 public school by the Washington Monthly.

Also discussed is an interesting statement from USU tailback Marcus Cross regarding “experimenting” with marijuana as well as anomolies in USU’s policy regarding marijuana use amongst athletes.